Conservative Americans
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Licensed by ASCAP, BMI & The MCPS-PRS Alliance
© 2008 SingSnap
Posted by Arizonagal on April 14, 2008 at 1:22 PM
Several threads have now been deleted due to flaming. This thread is designated specifically for conservative Americans to discuss U.S. and world politics. Please respect one another and abide by SingSnap/TOS rules. Thanks!
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 14, 2008 at 1:23 PM
So...what would y'all like to discuss? ;)
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Reply by JacquiGOLD on April 14, 2008 at 1:24 PM
Jacqui says man who fishes in another man's well often catches crabs.Conservate Americans, of course!
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 14, 2008 at 1:51 PM
Ok, Jacqui... you start! lol
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 14, 2008 at 1:58 PM
In the meantime, here's an email I received this morning:
Subject: A Bitter America?
Date: 4/14/2008 10:32:13 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time
Dear Friends,
We've all said things that we've regretted. Sometimes they result from a mere slip of the tongue and sometimes they reveal deeply held beliefs that you'd rather not communicate to the world.
A few days ago, at a San Francisco fundraiser, Barack Obama described Americans who live in small towns or other areas that have experienced a loss of jobs as "bitter" people, adding that it didn't surprise him that they, "..cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations."
These words are revealing on a number of levels, and expose the out-of-touch beliefs to which John McCain offers stark contrast. Today, John McCain offered a different account of small town America:
"During the Great Depression, with many millions of Americans out of work and the country suffering the worst economic crisis in our history, there rose from small towns, rural communities, inner cities, a generation of Americans who fought to save the world from despotism and mass murder, and came home to build the wealthiest, strongest and most generous nation on earth.
"They suffered the worst during the Depression, but it did not shake their faith in, and fidelity to, America. They did not turn to their religious faith and cultural traditions out of resentment and a feeling of powerlessness to affect the course of government or pursue prosperity. On the contrary, their faith had given generations of their families' purpose and meaning, as it does today."
These hard working men and women aren't "bitter". They love their country, their faith, their family and their traditions. They are the heart and soul of this country, the foundation of our strength and the primary authors of its essential goodness - Barack Obama should get to know them.
If Barack Obama is the Democrat nominee in the general election, the American people will have a clear choice between two different visions - Senator Obama's liberal, elitist philosophy and John McCain's faith in the small town values that continue to make America great. John McCain will not forget them or write them off. Neither should Barack Obama.
We are up against a large fundraising hurdle if Barack Obama is the nominee and we need your help now. Even before the general election begins, the differences are clear, we must do everything we can to make sure these beliefs don't make it into the White House.
Sincerely,
Rick Davis
Campaign Manager
P.S. - Barack Obama's belief that small town Americans are "bitter" exemplifies the differences in this election. We cannot allow this elitist philosophy to make its way into the White House.
__________________________
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Reply by Monique on April 14, 2008 at 3:35 PM
I'm not an American, so I don't belong here, but I am conservative (very!). What do you think? Can I comment? ;)
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 14, 2008 at 3:43 PM
Absolutely, Cherie! And welcome. :)
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Reply by Mattieb7103GOLD on April 14, 2008 at 3:43 PM
All I do is Pray that Obama doesn't make it to the White House, or Hilary either but I am not even sure I would want McCain!! What is one to do!! I do not think we will ever see anything worth having in the White House again, and I hate to even think about what's going to happen to the U.S. or what is already happening,,,,,,,
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Reply by Songslinger on April 14, 2008 at 3:49 PM
McCain will do just as he is told ;)
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Reply by tomcool on April 14, 2008 at 3:54 PM
President George Bush even with his low ratings has done a good job for this country. He has kelp us safe from those who would harm us in spite of the liberals and the Democrats.......tom
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Reply by rickorama on April 14, 2008 at 4:31 PM
When you think of all that President Bush has had to contend with tomcool, I have to whole heartedly agree.
I do not agree with Bush's stance on dealing with the flood of illegal aliens we have crossing our borders everyday, or even how he initially approached the war in Iraq...but, overall I would say he has done an extremely good job. Again, in the context of all he has had to deal with.
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 14, 2008 at 4:34 PM
Great responses, everyone...thanks for contributing! It's great to see that we can actually have calm, intelligent conversation about the issues which affect us as a nation, without all the controversy. :)
I'd just like to add...don't forget to research the candidates' voting records! We many not like certain personalities, and that's ok. It's a matter of principle.
Edited on April 14, 2008 at 4:37 PM Quote
Reply by eileenGOLD on April 14, 2008 at 4:43 PM
How about the failure of Hurricane Katriana? Everyone wants to blame Republicans in the White House, but do people know New Orleans was a Democratic state with a democratic governor and the poor people of that state were so dependent on handouts that when disaster struck, people were in a real mess? Yes, FEMA messed up and the president was slow to assist but it was the state of dependency in the first place that set up those people to fail. Democrats in office, people. LOL Any opinions?
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 14, 2008 at 4:49 PM
No opinions here...other than I totally agree with ya, Eileen. :)
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Reply by SpankyTECH-SUPPORT on April 14, 2008 at 4:50 PM
You are so correct!!!!
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Reply by rickorama on April 14, 2008 at 4:56 PM
I don't think the Hurricane Katrina devastation was handled well on the federal or state level. I do think, though, that the tragedy was turned into a political football by those on the left. They played the race card, insinuating that it is because of the African-American population in New Orleans that the Bush Administration reacted so slowly.
Eileen, however makes a very good point. The entire leadership of New Orleans appeared to have been both Democrat (left wing) and African-American.
So, what explains their dismal performance?
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Reply by Monique on April 14, 2008 at 5:05 PM
How nice. It looks like this thread is being visited by the targeted audience. I hope that lasts.
I also still support President Bush. Has he made mistakes? Of course, but the Presidency is not a dictatorship. The decisions he makes are based on the information presented to him by his very experienced advisors. He has the title of President (and scapegoat), but I seriously doubt he makes many, if any decisions all on his own. I still believe that the White House should be Republican and will back the Republican candidate.
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Reply by rickorama on April 14, 2008 at 5:09 PM
Conservative women rule.
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Reply by eileenGOLD on April 14, 2008 at 5:09 PM
The education system also fails our children. Does anyone have thoughts about how the education system fails poor children in spite of the fact it spends more money to educate them? How the beaucracy of the governmental (Democrat supported) school system fails our children? Why do Democrats so strongly dislike school vouchers and the like? If teachers were accountable for performance (charter schools and vouchers) wouldn't all children get an equal education?
Edited on April 14, 2008 at 5:10 PM Quote
Reply by eileenGOLD on April 14, 2008 at 5:16 PM
Of course it was. The system totally failed and people needed to find blame because people should not have suffered like that. We give so much to other nations and yet we failed our own people. Naturally people want to blame the president.
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Reply by eileenGOLD on April 14, 2008 at 5:20 PM
and you have on a very nice hat.
I always knew you were one of the smart ones, Rick!!!LOL
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Reply by rickorama on April 14, 2008 at 5:20 PM
As decades have passed, the public educational system has become more and more liberal. Most teachers and professors sit on the left side of the political isle. The Teacher's Union is a notoriously left wing organization.
It appears to me that kids have been "dumbed down" in some very important areas of study. One of which is American History.
Instead they are taught that America is to blame for all the ills of the world. America is an evil imperialistic nation. We are gluttonous consumers of all the world's resources and give little back. I think these teachers and professors are deliberately manipulating curriculum and misusing their positions to indoctrinate maliable minds into left wing thought.
Is it any wonder that such a disproportionate number of young voters tend to lean to the left?
Not only this, but is it not so that America is either last or near last in the fields of Mathematics and Science? Why is that?
The future of this nation is dependant upon the quality of our educational system. If we are not teaching our children the things they need to know to both understand what it means to be an American and how to compete in a now global economy, our nation is destined to decline.
Could that be what some people want? Is it too much to think that could be what is going on here? Or is that too conspiratorial?
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Reply by cwang50GOLD on April 14, 2008 at 5:25 PM
I agree with you on this.... and that the democrats have used this dependacy for a very long time...but the reciever will never see this.. and will blame those who point it out....which is understandable, as it is human nature to want what you got and more... it has nothing to do with race as some would contend..they will only contend when they feel that there is a "RACE" thingy going on, there is no races..only a human race all deriving from the same source upto 2008.
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Reply by Sultry_EyesGOLD on April 14, 2008 at 5:39 PM
Conspirises lol...........
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Reply by Sultry_EyesGOLD on April 14, 2008 at 5:41 PM
Shhhhhh lol no clowning about now hahaha
I'm in a giddy mood tonight lol............
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Reply by Sultry_EyesGOLD on April 14, 2008 at 5:43 PM
Do you ask them "before" or "after" lol.......
My naughty mind is in "full" swing tonight lol..........
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Reply by cwang50GOLD on April 14, 2008 at 6:09 PM
so you are clicking just as fast as I am ahaha and I might add thats because of the chocolate
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Reply by Sultry_EyesGOLD on April 14, 2008 at 6:26 PM
Lol I'm a fast worker or clicker even :-)
Oh I need another hershey peanut butter chocolate now. I never eat chocolate but..........those are just so irresistible once you have tasted one lol............
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 14, 2008 at 7:02 PM
Eileen and Rick...in regard to education...I have always found Phyllis Schlafly to be an excellent source of information...
http://www.eagleforum.org/
In regard to the dumbing down of America...check out information on Global 2000 and No Child Left Behind.
http://www.eagleforum.org/education/
Edited on April 14, 2008 at 7:06 PM Quote
Reply by Arizonagal on April 14, 2008 at 7:04 PM
I totally agree...no surprise there. ;)
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Reply by eileenGOLD on April 15, 2008 at 4:05 PM
Hi Ari!!
I checked out the Eagle Forum and it’s a great site. I read two articles. The first article about public education was so accurate it made my jaw hurt from falling so far to the floor! But I don’t want to discuss that yet.
As a site director/preschool teacher at a private, not for profit preschool/school age program, I am interested in the studies of daycare and the impact it has on children. Through my experience in the field, I have met a lot of children from all socio-economic and cultural walks of life. I have observed quite a bit about children and their families in programs over the years. I have maintained a love and care for kids and give them the best a center has to offer.
Two of the studies were done on children in full-time day center based care. The studies were conclusive to show children in daycare do not necessarily maintain a higher level of performance in school, in other words, by second grade it evens out. One of the studies also reported by age fifteen it declines. However, that measure leaves a lot to think about in terms of a child’s overall extenuating factors. My concern with these studies is the negative association to preschool in general.
So, I would have to take value in the study only up to a degree. First of all the effects of a child in a full-day program vs. a part day program will be very dramatic in all areas of the child’s development. One has to consider the physical, emotional, learning styles, and temperament of children in relation to the outside care. One child may thrive in a full-day program, while it may take another some long term adjustment. That’s a red flag right there. However, in my experience, full-time daycare takes its toll even on the best of children. These studies confirmed my opinion children should not be in full-time daycare because it may have negative effects (behavioral, ect.) or no real impact on long term development in school. I realize working parents may not like to hear this, but I believe it to be true. In spite of all the good a program has to offer, most children need the care and development of a stay home parent.
On the other hand, a part day preschool (three hours) has an amazing impact on children’s development. The key here is it has to be a quality program. A part -day quality pre-school program can be overwhelmingly beneficial for both kids and parents in their emotional development, well-being and school readiness. I am curious to see a study done with this group to prove my suspicions.
I also think part-time preschool should be free. It is a problem, I know, because I do not believe preschool should be in the hands of the states. Because in spite of more pay for teachers and all of the bells and whistles unions offer, it would surely be a bureaucratic, economic mess tenfold what the school system is currently.
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Reply by eileenGOLD on April 15, 2008 at 4:06 PM
I'm on break from Jury duty..sorry I wrote a book here!!
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Reply by eileenGOLD on April 15, 2008 at 4:29 PM
I just realized I forgot to name/cite the report:
"Do Pre-K Center Care Programs Work?"
Education Press, March 2003
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 15, 2008 at 11:38 PM
Wow, Eileen...I'm very impressed by your knowledge and experience! I knew you were a smart lady. :)
The public school system is like a war zone. It was bad when I chose to homeschool, but I would never enter a child in public school now...especially not a preschooler.
In a private sector, I can see how it would be beneficial for a young child for perhaps a couple of hours a day...provided they are emotionally ready for it. But the school would have to be independent of any government funding.
Edited to add...I'm so glad you found the site to be a reliable source of information. Mrs. Schlafly is a Harvard educated attorney, so her research is credible.
Edited on April 15, 2008 at 11:41 PM Quote
Reply by eileenGOLD on April 16, 2008 at 12:49 AM
Aw, thanks Ari..I appreciate your input. I wish I could homeschool my son but he is a gifted learner and does well in the public school system so far. We have been blessed with a great school and teachers, one of the best in our district. He (my son) has superior math aptitude and after winning the school, district spelling Bees he competed in the county Bee where he placed 12th out of 15. He got nervous and flubbed his word. He did have the highest preliminary score on the written test in all of the county spellers which just amazed us. Were really proud of him but I just wouldn't be able to keep up with him.
wow..couln't pass up a chance to brag about my son..lol
We are some of the lucky ones because my son will excel in any program. I work to ensure he has all the best opportunites and he is challenged at every level but I worry about the future of the education system and for children that can barely meet standards. Its appalling the budget is such a mess and some teachers still have their jobs in spite of performance.
which reminds me of this story...
A child had something stolen from his backpack..or so he claimed.anyway,he told the teacher and after interrogating the children (3rd graders) she made all of them write a letter saying "who they thought stole it" and 'what should their punishment be.." These were third graders who were left with the task of accusing a peer and deciding how they should be punished. When parents found about this "assignment" they were stunned. The teacher was "talked to" by the principal.
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Reply by AmymamaGOLD on April 16, 2008 at 1:01 AM
Yep Kevin....just another puppet on strings.
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 16, 2008 at 2:24 PM
Hi, Eileen... and you're very welcome! You have a right to be proud, and your son is very lucky to have a loving, caring mom like you. :)
I've heard the story you related in the past. This is what public schools are emphasizing today (as opposed to academics, it's socialization). It's very sad for our kids/grandkids.
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 16, 2008 at 2:28 PM
McCain on education...
EXCELLENCE, CHOICE, AND COMPETITION IN AMERICAN EDUCATION
John McCain believes American education must be worthy of the promise we make to our children and ourselves. He understands that we are a nation committed to equal opportunity, and there is no equal opportunity without equal access to excellent education.
Public education should be defined as one in which our public support for a child's education follows that child into the school the parent chooses. The school is charged with the responsibility of educating the child, and must have the resources and management authority to deliver on that responsibility. They must also report to the parents and the public on their progress.
The deplorable status of preparation for our children, particularly in comparison with the rest of the industrialized world, does not allow us the luxury of eliminating options in our educational repertoire. John McCain will fight for the ability of all students to have access to all schools of demonstrated excellence, including their own homes.
No Child Left Behind has focused our attention on the realities of how students perform against a common standard. John McCain believes that we can no longer accept low standards for some students and high standards for others. In this age of honest reporting, we finally see what is happening to students who were previously invisible. While that is progress all its own, it compels us to seek and find solutions to the dismal facts before us.
John McCain believes our schools can and should compete to be the most innovative, flexible and student-centered - not safe havens for the uninspired and unaccountable. He believes we should let them compete for the most effective, character-building teachers, hire them, and reward them.
If a school will not change, the students should be able to change schools. John McCain believes parents should be empowered with school choice to send their children to the school that can best educate them just as many members of Congress do with their own children. He finds it beyond hypocritical that many of those who would refuse to allow public school parents to choose their child's school would never agree to force their own children into a school that did not work or was unsafe. They can make another choice. John McCain believes that is a fundamental and essential right we should honor for all parents.
As president, John McCain will pursue reforms that address the underlying cultural problems in our education system - a system that still seeks to avoid genuine accountability and responsibility for producing well-educated children.
John McCain will place parents and children at the center of the education process, empowering parents by greatly expanding the ability of parents to choose among schools for their children. He believes all federal financial support must be predicated on providing parents the ability to move their children, and the dollars associated with them, from failing schools.
____________________
Such is the hypocrisy...
Hillary Clinton supports the right of thirteen-year-old girls to have abortions without parental consent--yet she forbade thirteen-year-old Chelsea to pierce her ears and enrolled her in a school that would not distribute condoms to minors.
Edited on April 16, 2008 at 2:30 PM Quote
Reply by Arizonagal on April 16, 2008 at 2:31 PM
To whom do you refer? The CFR/Trilateral Commission? Every U.S. President must be a member of the aforementioned. No president acts alone.
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Reply by CrestenPixieGOLD on April 16, 2008 at 3:14 PM
Re: McCain's thoughs on education
No Child Left Behind is failing because it puts too much emphasis on standardized tests, which leads to "teaching to the test" It does not take into account students with emotional, physical, or learning disabilities. Punishes the many for the failings of a few, yet still allows parents to opt. out of required testing, and allows parents to move their child through the school system regardless of the recommendation of the "highly qualified" professionals to hold them back and allow for catching up. It puts no responsibility on the parents for follow-through at home, something that has been proven to be necessary through countless studies, and many states still allow students to drop out of H.S. at age 16. If you want every child to graduate then make it REQUIRED!!!
NCLB is bad law...they should be rewarding schools that succeed not penalizing schools that fail.
And I'll say it again, PARENTS NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE TOO! Too many parents put no importance on homework, grades, learning to read, or graduating. They just want their kids moved through the system and out of the house as soon as possible. Meanwhile the students left in the school are receiving less money due to the failings of those few.
Did you know that if less than 95% of a school takes a test the entire school is considered failing?
Did you know that if any sub-group in the school (ie, African Americans, Arabic students, Special Ed. students, etc.) fails the test that the whole school is considered failing?
Did you know that learning disabled and learning impaired students do not get a modified test to take? They take the same test as those with perfect IQ's and are expected to do just as well?
Did you know that a student who is failing every subject in 3rd grade, who is recommended to repeat the grade by the teacher, can be passed on to 4th grade simply because the parent wants them to?
Does this sound like a recipe for success to you?
Many schools are failing not because the teachers are bad, but because they are in a socio-economic area that does not put a strong emphasis on education and there is no support on the home side. I've worked in these schools and we've changed everything we can think of to reach these kids, but parents/foster parents/grandparents/guardians do not deem it important so the child doesn't either.
Moving failing students to a passing school is not the answer, it will only bring down the scores of passing schools causing them to become failing schools.
I would like to see McCain address solutions to these issues.
Edited on April 16, 2008 at 3:19 PM Quote
Reply by AmymamaGOLD on April 16, 2008 at 3:22 PM
Something much darker and sinister then the ones you're referring to ari.
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 16, 2008 at 5:54 PM
Who, Amy? Do you have any sources? Credible sources, as opposed to YouTube?
Edited on April 16, 2008 at 5:56 PM Quote
Reply by Arizonagal on April 16, 2008 at 5:56 PM
McCain's official website:
http://www.johnmccain.com/
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Reply by AmymamaGOLD on April 16, 2008 at 5:56 PM
Ari, i am not doing this. You know fully who I am talking about but every single thing I have ever showed you is just not credible enough.
My resources are not through a controlled media like yours. So I will just leave it at that.
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Reply by eileenGOLD on April 16, 2008 at 6:00 PM
Can you share it with me? cause I'd like to know.
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 16, 2008 at 6:02 PM
Who controls your media sources, Amy?
Edited on April 16, 2008 at 6:03 PM Quote
Reply by AmymamaGOLD on April 16, 2008 at 7:41 PM
(quote) Ari's question
not the fourth branch of the Government that's for dang sure.
You are just another American that believes our Government can't possibly be evil. That they would never intentionally hurt us but this is not true.
There are people that do alot of research and use well...common sense to figure out that the lies and betrayal are very real.
I mean didn't it even strike you as odd that Clinton, Obama and McCain all have the same blood lines as other important people.
You even said it yourself ari. Our Country is borderline communist so why would it be so hard for you to believe some of the things I say?
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Reply by AmymamaGOLD on April 16, 2008 at 7:43 PM
I would be happy to Eileen but first let me ask you something..
Are you against youtube as well?
Or Alex Jones?
How about good old fashioned Americans that have gotten together to fight the government?
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Reply by Arizonagal on April 16, 2008 at 8:12 PM
WEDNESDAY, APRIL 16, 2008
From: American Center For Law And Justice (ACLJ)
PETITION OF PROTEST
You shouldn't have to abandon your personal beliefs to get ahead in this world.
You should never be labeled ''close-minded'' or ''blinded by belief'' just because you have chosen to follow Jesus Christ.
Agree?
If you do, the ACLJ needs your name added to our National Petition of Protest RIGHT NOW.
What are we protesting? Today, college student Gina D. is facing just the type of blatant and divisive discrimination I described above in her Introduction to Philosophy class.
And at the ACLJ, we strongly object (you can even read our demand letter online for all the details). And after you read the facts, I know you will agree that we cannot allow this situation to continue and spiral out of control. We are prepared to go the distance - to file a lawsuit, if necessary - to help Gina and other college students in similar situations across the country. But we need your help for maximum - and immediate - impact.
Here are the facts:
Gina is an excellent student. Her grade point average is a 3.9 out of a possible 4.0. She has good relationships with her professors at Suffolk County Community College (SCCC).
Introduction to Philosophy is a required class for all students at SCCC.
For the first several class assignments, Gina received perfect grades.
That all changed when God and religion became prominent topics of class discussion and her refusal to compromise her Christian faith became apparent.
Her professor, Philip P., has not only docked her grades ... he has repeatedly derided Gina for her faith in online class discussions, calling her ''close-minded,'' ''uncritical,'' ''hurtful,'' and ''blinded by belief'' simply because she will not adopt his way of thinking. He has also said that to engage in dialogue, you have to at least acknowledge the possibility that God does not exist.
Add your name to our National Petition of Protest RIGHT NOW - as we make every effort to alert and inform SCCC and this professor of Gina's First Amendment rights and call for an end to this religious hostility.
I'm sure you agree this is an outrageous situation. It seems this one professor is on a personal crusade to get his students to change their own personal viewpoints or state that they are unsure of whether their own personal beliefs are correct.
Gina, a believer in Jesus Christ, is paying the price. In fact, we are getting calls from other students around the country facing similar discrimination.
We hope all it takes to end this unfairness once and for all is tens of thousands of Petitions of Protest from across the nation to SCCC - calling on them to take immediate action.
It is unconstitutional for a public college professor to make passing a required course contingent upon a student's willingness to express agreement with philosophical viewpoints that conflict with her religious beliefs.
Sign your name to our National Petition of Protest NOW and use our website forward-to-friend tool to encourage your friends and family to join our nationwide campaign also. Read our demand letter online as well.
I will keep you updated on the ACLJ's work to protect the constitutional rights of students around the country. Thank you.
https://www.aclj.org/Petition/Default.aspx?sc=3341&ac=1
Edited on April 16, 2008 at 8:14 PM Quote
Reply by Arizonagal on April 16, 2008 at 8:19 PM
Sorry, but you do not label me, Amy. "You" is accusatory and your analysis of me doesn't hold water. In other words, I define myself...you do not define me, nor what I believe in and stand for. This isn't about me, anyway...I asked you who your sources were, and who they are controlled by.
What is your genealogical source which proves they all share the same blood line?
Edited on April 16, 2008 at 8:20 PM Quote
Reply by Arizonagal on April 16, 2008 at 8:28 PM
Alex Jones is considered by many to be the grandfather of what has come to be known as the 9/11 Truth Movement.
In 1998 Jones spearheaded the effort to rebuild the David Koresh led Branch Davidian compound/church near Waco, Texas. He often featured the project on his cable access program and claimed that Koresh and his followers were peaceful people that were murdered by Attorney General Janet Reno and the ATF (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives) in the infamous Waco Siege.
-----------------
Glenn Beck on the 9/11 Conspiracy Theory (10/22/07)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnKppff5yQ8
Edited on April 16, 2008 at 8:33 PM Quote