I've been thinking...

that was some tasty food for thought ;o)

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scarlettohall wrote:And, I came across this story..I won't post the whole thing here but, it was about a Faith Study Group. I want to share the last paragraph of the story..it deals with part of the bible where it speaks of curing the sick, raising the dead, casting out demons..etc.

Let's reflect on the persons in this group: Carol sits with a sick neighbor whose children seldom come to see her. Since Carol has been doing this, the neighbor has stopped her constant weeping and learned to smile again. Isn't Carol curing the sick? Estelle works for a social agency. Last year, she worked incessantly to restore the self-confidence of a young girl who had attempted to kill herself because she felt she had nothing to live for. Today, the girl is registering for her G.E.D. Isn't Estelle raising the dead? Jim is a supervisor of a hall in the local detox center for adolescents. On the night round, he constantly breaks up fights between some of the young persons who come the the center filled with anger and hatred so that sometimes , their only way of relating is by doing violence. Isn't Jim casting out demons?

Might this be examples of how WE can be GOOD SHEPHERDS to one another, in the name of Jesus, the Good Shepherd? Think about it!! :)

Human contact and caring about someone and paying attention to them sometimes is better than medication..

It has been proven if a new born baby is never touched.. never held... no human contact they will die.

We need other people in our life. No man is an Island so they say.. And I do believe we can make a huge difference by a small gesture of kindness and caring.. :)

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I think we can all be 'good sheperds', (at least part-time), even if we don't necessarily gain that quality through faith in Jesus.

Some of the smallest, most inconsequential things I have ever done, turned out to mean so much to someone.

Either way ya slice it, a caring heart is valuable, and might bring some small hapiness to a person that has little or none. :-)

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lol

i knew i was someone would say that.

i should be the staight man on a comedy team - lol

drumroll - presenting Jo (the good) and Sum (the not so good)

but remember, he also created those pesky lil salmonella bacteria to annoy his 'images' and make em not eat tomatos every now and then, so it takes some of us longer to 'know' than others. have patience, we'll understand eventualy, even if it's too late when we do. ;-)

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What a wonderful way to view what the human spirit can do!!There really is Heaven on Earth!

Thanks, Jo..great story..;)

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scarlettohall wrote:Patience is one of my strong points. ;)

I was also blessed with a plethora of patience..that is why I teach!!

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scarlettohall wrote:And, I came across this story..I won't post the whole thing here but, it was about a Faith Study Group. I want to share the last paragraph of the story..it deals with part of the bible where it speaks of curing the sick, raising the dead, casting out demons..etc.

Let's reflect on the persons in this group: Carol sits with a sick neighbor whose children seldom come to see her. Since Carol has been doing this, the neighbor has stopped her constant weeping and learned to smile again. Isn't Carol curing the sick? Estelle works for a social agency. Last year, she worked incessantly to restore the self-confidence of a young girl who had attempted to kill herself because she felt she had nothing to live for. Today, the girl is registering for her G.E.D. Isn't Estelle raising the dead? Jim is a supervisor of a hall in the local detox center for adolescents. On the night round, he constantly breaks up fights between some of the young persons who come the the center filled with anger and hatred so that sometimes , their only way of relating is by doing violence. Isn't Jim casting out demons?

Might this be examples of how WE can be GOOD SHEPHERDS to one another, in the name of Jesus, the Good Shepherd? Think about it!! :)

worth thinking about!!!!

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I wonder how I missed this thread?

I think you yourself are a fine example of a good shepherd Jo.

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That was beautiful and touching......thanks for sharing it

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scarlettohall wrote:Well, I tend to think ALL of us get it through Jesus, even if we don't know it yet. Remember.....we were created "in His own image". :)

Can you honestly think you will say this if you were born in Iraq or India?

Almost certainly, if in Iraq, you would say that Mohammad is the wisest of men. If in India, you would worship Krishna instead of Jesus.

We ought to try to transcend the limitations of space-time and culture.

Edited on November 14, 2008 at 11:25 PM Quote

sgwitness wrote:

scarlettohall wrote:Well, I tend to think ALL of us get it through Jesus, even if we don't know it yet. Remember.....we were created "in His own image". :)

Can you honestly think you will say this if you were born in Iraq or India?

Almost certainly, if in Iraq, you would say that Mohammad is the wisest of men. If in India, you would worship Krishna instead of Jesus.

We ought to try to transcend the limitations of space-time and culture.

I read Jo's story, and I think it's beautiful and I agree with it. Do those other religions share similar notions, though, of carrying on goodwill in the name of who's worshipped? I'm thinking in terms of comparative religion in this case with her story examples.

edited to say...maybe that would be going way to off topic though.... :|

Edited on November 15, 2008 at 4:07 AM Quote

My point, really, is that though one thinks that one's own beliefs are the most true, religion is, in most cases, a matter of where you were born and the influences you were subjected to.

As to whether other religions can be equally inspirational... you betcha.

As to whether they are true... that's another thing altogether.

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I thought the story was beautiful too. I wasn't referring to the story but to the fact that you felt that the whole world revolves around Jesus.

Of course you weren't born in those places. The point in that thought experiment is to illustrate the idea that the whole world is certainly more multi-religious and multi-cultural than you seem to think.

But just maybe, I might have misinterpreted you for thinking that "ALL" refers to all of humanity. Perhaps you just meant it as all the people in your country. Even then this would be presumptuous because most countries today of any appreciable size are probably culturally and religiously diverse.

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scarlettohall wrote:No, you didn't misinterpret that part, Sg. Not entirely. :)

What I meant was that "MY" belief is that whether we believe in Jesus or not.....our good traits..love, compassion, etc. etc..come from Him from God. Does that make more sense?

you seem very moderate to me....i like your approach....

but in this i have to disagree. 'all' means all.....'our' means 'all' of us. you and 'all' people of faith like to speak in terms of the world in entirety, and god. as if to say 'my god or none'.....that has never sat well with me...

altruism is one of the most benign qualities we possess...and the consequences of it are even more beautiful.....might it not be due to 'our' ability to rise above our environment and exposure to selfishness? i do like to think so...

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Hi, no I don't think he meant your statement.

I think it was a general statement to say altruism is inherent in the human species which enables us all to behave unselfishly even in an environment that encourages sefishness.

If this is what UncleDave means, then I agree with him.

We are all capable of looking out for one another and other species without believing in Jesus.

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Scarlett...

Not selfish, as much as presumptuous and neglecting to take into account the reality that different people worship different entities in different places. How can you presume that your version applies universally (as you seem to want to imply -- "...ALL of us get it through Jesus, even if we don't know it yet.")

You have a right to this belief of course, but it is still presumptuous. :))

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scarlettohall wrote:You think my statement was selfish?

I think we're still misunderstanding each other. Yes, I believe in ONE God so yes when I say all I mean ALL. BUT...that does not undermine others that have beliefs in other Gods/deities. I also have a very open mind to other belief systems but, mine is the one that I feel is right for me. I'm not sure how to explain what I mean. I believe that Ghandi is in heaven even though he wasn't Christian.....haha...am I making any sense here at all?

Really? You think someone that did not believe in God is in Heaven? I'm very curious about that statement Jo, since you and I have had a whole lot of Biblical discussions.

I personally don't believe anyone dies and goes right to Heaven so I'm not arguing who is and who isn't in Heaven. I'm not arguing anything actually ... Just wondering.

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Just wondering aloud...

What is so evil or immoral about non-belief in god? Why must that mean that such persons cannot go to heaven? Really, what sort of logic does such a belief amount to?

I am assuming of course, that words such as "heaven" or "god" are meaningful in the first place -- which is not necessarily the case. I am just trying to think from the perspective of those who believe in these things.

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scarlettohall wrote:Yes, Cherie..actually I do. The God I know is loving, and more forgiving than we can ever imagine. I believe that if someone, like Gandhi for example, lived their lives the way God intends us to live our lives..He is not going to punish them in the afterlife simply because they were raised to believe something other than Christianity.

Let's say someone was born and raised to be atheist, they lived to be 100 years old and not once in their whole lives committed a sin....do you really think God would send them to hell just because they didn't believe?

All men are sinners. Only one has ever lived a perfect life.

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LAngeloMysterioso wrote:

scarlettohall wrote:Yes, Cherie..actually I do. The God I know is loving, and more forgiving than we can ever imagine. I believe that if someone, like Gandhi for example, lived their lives the way God intends us to live our lives..He is not going to punish them in the afterlife simply because they were raised to believe something other than Christianity.

Let's say someone was born and raised to be atheist, they lived to be 100 years old and not once in their whole lives committed a sin....do you really think God would send them to hell just because they didn't believe?

All men are sinners. Only one has ever lived a perfect life.

Oh well.....good job I'm a woman then. No sin here.

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Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

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Romans 3:25_____Whom God hath set forth [to be] a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

i John 2:2____And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for [the sins of] the whole world.

1 John 4:10_____Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son [to be] the propitiation for our sins.

Romans 6:23_____For the wages of sin [is] death; but the gift of God [is] eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

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scarlettohall wrote:Yes, Cherie..actually I do. The God I know is loving, and more forgiving than we can ever imagine. I believe that if someone, like Gandhi for example, lived their lives the way God intends us to live our lives..He is not going to punish them in the afterlife simply because they were raised to believe something other than Christianity.

Let's say someone was born and raised to be atheist, they lived to be 100 years old and not once in their whole lives committed a sin....do you really think God would send them to hell just because they didn't believe?

Hi Joanne, thanks for posting this. There are millions of people on this earth who aren't Christians, I have friends who are Christians, Muslims, Sikhs, Hindus, etc ,and it makes me cringe when I hear people here make disparaging remarks about other faiths.

I may be an atheist but I respect other people's beliefs, and you are one of the few really genuine people here and I enjoy reading your posts. Just wanted to say that :)

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Mark 12:32____And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is (one God); and there is none other but he:

Matthew 6:24___No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

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Well, after going back and reading most of the other posts here I guess it is to all of them, but in a humble and kind way so please don't think I am being rude. I find this is very interesting and I hope you don't mind my posting here. I'm off to my Circle of Friends meeting now. Be back later !

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Aww,,That Dodgeman is messing me up again...I don't have time so thats not him , it's Sunshine messing up again. Gotta go !

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I believe there are false gods. I believe there is one GOD. I believe there is Satan. I believe you have to decide which one you are going to go with. Some Gods prove themselves to be evil and really Satan. I choose The God that has proven himself to be loving, helping, and caring when I ask for it and all powerful. This GOD happens to have stated what he believes in he Bible. Since he has proved he is real to me, I believe everything he says. This is just my opinion about other Gods. God says a lot in the Bible about false Gods.

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"I've been thinking..."

I've been trying to give that up..LOL

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MrsM wrote:I believe there are false gods. I believe there is one GOD. I believe there is Satan. I believe you have to decide which one you are going to go with. Some Gods prove themselves to be evil and really Satan. I choose The God that has proven himself to be loving, helping, and caring when I ask for it and all powerful. This GOD happens to have stated what he believes in he Bible. Since he has proved he is real to me, I believe everything he says. This is just my opinion about other Gods. God says a lot in the Bible about false Gods.

Interesting. Of course one can believe in all kinds of stuff. But whether such beliefs constitute the truth -- that's a different story altogether.

If you had been born in Iraq, you would have sworn that Mohammad was Allah's greatest prophet, and the Koran as the greatest gift to mankind. Born in India, and it would have been very natural for you to see Krishna as Lord as depicted in the Bhagavad Gita. Can such beliefs be easily dismissed?

More importantly, how do we separate grain from chaff? Seeing the big picture helps. We need to transcend the limitations of our time-space and culture.

Just my two cents.

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and put a nickel in the drum...save another drunken bum

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sgwitness wrote:

MrsM wrote:I believe there are false gods. I believe there is one GOD. I believe there is Satan. I believe you have to decide which one you are going to go with. Some Gods prove themselves to be evil and really Satan. I choose The God that has proven himself to be loving, helping, and caring when I ask for it and all powerful. This GOD happens to have stated what he believes in he Bible. Since he has proved he is real to me, I believe everything he says. This is just my opinion about other Gods. God says a lot in the Bible about false Gods.

Interesting. Of course one can believe in all kinds of stuff. But whether such beliefs constitute the truth -- that's a different story altogether.

If you had been born in Iraq, you would have sworn that Mohammad was Allah's greatest prophet, and the Koran as the greatest gift to mankind. Born in India, and it would have been very natural for you to see Krishna as Lord as depicted in the Bhagavad Gita. Can such beliefs be easily dismissed?

More importantly, how do we separate grain from chaff? Seeing the big picture helps. We need to transcend the limitations of our time-space and culture.

Just my two cents.

I appreciate your two cents. Thanks, But Mohammad and Krishna would have to prove themselves to me before I just believed them. God proves himself to me over and over again. I do transcend the limitations of my time-space and culture. I read the living word of God.

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Just curious MrsM....

But have you read the Koran or the Gita?

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I've read some of the Koran and about it's history! It's not a subject I would discuss on Singsnap.

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MrsM....

But of course you don't have to. But surely you do realise that there are people who feel about the Koran, the Gita, the Dhammapada, the Tao Te Ching..... exactly the same way you feel about the bible.

The original problem remains. How does one separate the grain from the chaff? How can you be so sure that your beliefs are true?

Edited on November 21, 2008 at 6:53 AM Quote

I think a 'false God' would be to worship wealth or consumerism if it meant trampling over other people and being ruthless for instance.

As there are different religions, they meet the spiritual needs of many cultures. It doesn't mean you have to change YOUR beliefs. Just a bit of respect for other people's beliefs would be nice.

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sgwitness wrote:

The original problem remains. How does one separate the grain from the chaff? How can you be so sure that your beliefs are true?

I hope you don't mind my butting in here but I can't help myself.
According to the Bible God will seperate the grain from the chaff. I know that there are those who don't believe the Bible but that is because they don't understand it. I don't totally understand it either and I don't pretend to be an expert. In answer to the question "How do you know your beliefs are true" I can only give you my experience.
When I accepted Jesus as my savior I felt it. He changed me into a different person that could teach sunday school. I became kinder. I had a concience that I had'nt really had before. My life was a shambles and I felt a peace and a fulfillment I had never felt before and it has stayed with me through all the bad times. He has always answered my prayers. Maybe not like I wanted but God new a better way always. The main thing I realized was that I started understanding the Bible better. When you are not Gods child you don't have the ability to understand. He gives you that along with a thirst to read his words and and wisdom to understand them.
Yes there are many different religions . But there is one true God and our great commission ... If you have a Bible read Matthew 27:18-20
One more thing that proves my belief is that Everything that the old testament says is going to happen does happen in the New Testament. The Bible is written perfectly all connecting together if you understand it and everything is coming true if you keep up with the news.
LOL, I had to put my two cents in !God Bless You :)

Edited on November 21, 2008 at 11:08 AM Quote

Sunshine, MrsM...

Am just playing the proverbial Devil's (pun intended?!) advocate here...

Seriously, I have no doubt whatsoever that you truly are sincere about your beliefs. But know that in the same way, the Muslims, the Hindus, the Buddhists.... are equally sincere and ardent about their beliefs. Their beliefs are equally life-changing for them and they are as equally confident that their holy books contain nothing but absolute truths.

As said, the original problem remains. Which one, if any, is the real McCoy?

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sgwitness wrote:Sunshine, MrsM...

Am just playing the proverbial Devil's (pun intended?!) advocate here...

Seriously, I have no doubt whatsoever that you truly are sincere about your beliefs. But know that in the same way, the Muslims, the Hindus, the Buddhists.... are equally sincere and ardent about their beliefs. Their beliefs are equally life-changing for them and they are as equally confident that their holy books contain nothing but absolute truths.

As said, the original problem remains. Which one, if any, is the real McCoy?

It's not my place to judge the Muslims, the Hindus, or the Buddhists and I am not going to attemp to. The problem of "finding the real McCoy" is given to each individual person.

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sgwitness wrote:Sunshine, MrsM...

Am just playing the proverbial Devil's (pun intended?!) advocate here...

Seriously, I have no doubt whatsoever that you truly are sincere about your beliefs. But know that in the same way, the Muslims, the Hindus, the Buddhists.... are equally sincere and ardent about their beliefs. Their beliefs are equally life-changing for them and they are as equally confident that their holy books contain nothing but absolute truths.

As said, the original problem remains. Which one, if any, is the real McCoy?

Hi..

There is only one Real McCoy as you put it...One God...

Do you think that God doesn't have the divine power to let his children know him even if they are at the end of the earth.. No communication with anyone.. Blind.. Deaf..

God is the one who opens our hearts. .. Our ears and our mind to accept him into our hearts.. It is a gift. It is by grace that any of us are saved.

So some may worship perhaps another God.. But there is only one God. If it is meant for those to know him they will. :)

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