Singing high notes

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socomicefoxLEVEL 77

Edited post by socomicefoxGOLD

Singing high notes can be a challenge and it is good to challenge yourself! But sing healthy yall I am hearing lots of singers belt out high notes/strain struggle to hit these high notes! Thing is that is not how you hit a high note.

And I am gonna be honest with you it does not matter how much diaphragm breathing you do! If you cant hit a certain range in your voice you wont hit that range until you work out your voice correctly and get your voice stronger. Ya know like how you gain muscle when you work out you dont gain muscle overnight it takes time. Same way with singing. You want to hit a high note in a song? Good find your max range in your voice meaning hit every note you can until you feel yourself strain/struggle and go from there. Sing like that for about a week and notice how those high notes become not forced not a struggle but as if you are talking

Singing is good for the heart. It can be healthy for sure! But singing can also ruin your voice permanently. If singing not correctly straining/struggling/forcing high notes that your voice can not meet/hit you will end up you can ruin your voice. Get vocal nodules that sometimes you gotta get the doctors to do surgery on not just that but they could order you to go on vocal rest for a year straight of no singing at all! Yep! 100% sing correctly sing healthy drink your water hit notes that you know you can and dont go over your normal range. Do that and you are singing correctly. Singing is like talking. Its simple its easy and if its not easy to you and you feel strain in your voice or you feel like your voice is tired easy well you are singing the wrong way.

JPickLEVEL 72

Reply by JPickGOLD

Any example?

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

Any example?JPick

For every vocal question a Google search or a Youtube search will give you answers:

One of the comments on Youtube:

"To everyone making the comments of "What does it matter if it's bad technique!? They sound great!" ... Having poor technique does not always equate sounding bad. But the reason having poor technique is bad is because it is damaging to your voice. You/they may not care right now, but in a few years when they've completely blown out their vocal chords from constant abuse due to poor technique, you're gonna care. Kelly Clarkson almost lost her voice due to it. Technique always has been and always will be important."

Signs of bad technique could be any one or all of the following:
1. A lot of strain.
2. Requiring too much effort (very costly in terms of vocal dollars).
3. Struggling to climb the high notes.
4. Unpleasant sound or not as pleasant as it could be.
5. The high notes are flat.
6. Vocal fatigue or voice hoarseness after the performance.
7. Experiencing pain or vocal discomfort when executing the notes.

JPickLEVEL 72

Edited reply by JPickGOLD

For every vocal question a Google search or a Youtube search will give you answerssabathiel
Thanks for the link and the explanation, but the OP wrote "I am hearing lots of singers belt out high notes/strain struggle to hit these high notes" and he was referring to SS amateurial singers. I'd like to listen to those examples. And it's just understandable most people on SS lack technique

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

For every vocal question a Google search or a Youtube search will give you answerssabathiel
Thanks for the link and the explanation, but the OP wrote "I am hearing lots of singers belt out high notes/strain struggle to hit these high notes" and he was referring to SS amateurial singers. I'd like to listen to those examples. And it's just understandable most people on SS lack technique JPick

It is kinda against the rules to post SS singers on a forum to be used as examples of bad singers or bad technique. If that is not in the SS Terms of Use or Code of Conduct it is certainly an unwritten rule on this forum. It is a form of humiliation or put down to highlight another SS singer as an example of poor technique unless of course that other person consents to being used as such an example. So yeah he won't or can't do that.

Having bad or poor technique is understandable. Most amateurs probably have bad technique but having bad technique and stretching your vocal cords to hit super high notes beyond your skill is extremely damaging to your vocal health. I think that is what the OP is mostly concerned about. It is not just simply about singers having bad technique per se but bad technique doing very high notes. That is pushing your boundaries on a dangerous level.

JPickLEVEL 72

Reply by JPickGOLD

I think the intent is good, but kinda useless, because people won't know it's about them.

I got criticism about my singing on here, and never got offended. People should lighten up. Anyway, I'm always open to learning, so maybe the poster will feel comfortable sending me links and explaining further

SoloSongstressLEVEL 102

Reply by SoloSongstressGOLD +1

I think the intent is good, but kinda useless, because people won't know it's about them.

I got criticism about my singing on here, and never got offended. People should lighten up. Anyway, I'm always open to learning, so maybe the poster will feel comfortable sending me links and explaining further JPick

I will offer myself as an example. I am a natural alto with the range to hit soprano notes with varied results. I've consistently been given the feedback that I sound better when I stick with lower songs by artists such as Anita Baker, Toni Braxton, etc. But I also WANT to sing songs by artists such as Mariah Carey, Whitney Houston, etc. The result is that I strain to hit the high notes sometimes and go flat. I've never had 1 on 1 vocal training, so I know that I lack proper technique. I'm trying to learn as much as I can on my own and trying to improve.

Yesterday I made a recording that was truly awful that normally I would not have kept, but I will share it as an example of what NOT to do. Knowing all that I do about my vocal challenges, I chose THIS song, and proceeded to sing it while lying down. Apologies in advance.

http://www.singsnap.com/karaoke/r/bd84af093

Tinypumpkin

Reply by TinypumpkinGOLD

SingSnap Is My Home and I love you all!

I think the intent is good, but kinda useless, because people won't know it's about them.

I got criticism about my singing on here, and never got offended. People should lighten up. Anyway, I'm always open to learning, so maybe the poster will feel comfortable sending me links and explaining further JPick

I will offer myself as an example. I am a natural alto with the range to hit soprano notes with varied results. I've consistently been given the feedback that I sound better when I stick with lower songs by artists such as Anita Baker, Toni Braxton, etc. But I also WANT to sing songs by artists such as Mariah Carey, Whitney Houston, etc. The result is that I strain to hit the high notes sometimes and go flat. I've never had 1 on 1 vocal training, so I know that I lack proper technique. I'm trying to learn as much as I can on my own and trying to improve.

Yesterday I made a recording that was truly awful that normally I would not have kept, but I will share it as an example of what NOT to do. Knowing all that I do about my vocal challenges, I chose THIS song, and proceeded to sing it while lying down. Apologies in advance.

http://www.singsnap.com/karaoke/r/bd84af093SoloSongstress

Hey Sis! You are a class above a lot of people. I'm just an amateur but I do know you are a talented singer and you are so humble.

There are some people who claimed to be good but it's 'in your head'...

cannotsing24LEVEL 108

Edited reply by cannotsing24GOLD +3

Thank you for a year of Gold, all the trinkets and listening to my recordings,color name..

Any example?JPick

my way to deal with pitch,,,,,,
do not drink milk, ice-cream,
it is also to do with breathing Excs
normal ,,,,,,,take less sugar
drink warm water pure honey and lime juice few drops to a cup
Excs for the lips do movements
Sit up strait , do not cross your legs while singing
hold shoulders up and strait , soul of your feet should be balanced to the floor
hope it works ,,,,,while taking a pitch note ,,,slight tilt of head up

Annie_MusicLEVEL 103

Edited reply by Annie_MusicGOLD

For hitting the high note, envision and hear the note before you hit it. Practice the interval. Read and listen to as much singing instruction as you can. If you want you'll practice it over and over. Listen to your recording and work on and correct the parts that don't sound good. Yes to what Soco said above; if it feels bad, stop; if you're voice is hoarse after singing the song, you're doing it wrong Some songs that you strain and hurt over maybe aren't for you, unless you try changing the pitch it may help, maybe not. Sing songs that are comfortable for you; maybe later try others carefully. There's lots of music instruction on youtube. When you go to hit a high note you may need to use another register so make the adjustment in your mind and be conscious of it happening. Diet makes a difference in singing like Shirley says above, don't drink or eat dairy products. Avoid meat too. Eating a whole food plant-based clean diet works wonders for not just singing but everything Exercise, get outdoors in nature, proper breathing. Also be in tune to what products you expose yourself to. Keep your space free of chemical fragrances in personal and cleaning products that alter the air you breathe daily. Lots to consider, but all these apply to much more than singing! Singing is from the body and mind and having a healthy body in tune is super! My opinions and experience

ZZ-EdLEVEL 67

Reply by ZZ-EdGOLD

I have always been amazed at the idea of honey or any other substance actually affecting your voice when...what you eat/drink/swallow (esophagus) has absolutely nothing to do with your vocal chords which...should something go down THAT way (trachea) would immediately cause you to aspirate and (at the very least) gag and cough your brains/lungs out...or (worse case) DIE a very uncomfortable death.

jeannetteb

Reply by jeannettebGOLD

Jubi

Edited reply by JubiGOLD

I'm a mezzo soprano. On a good day when the sinus and allergies are not acting up, I can even go high soprano. Still, I don't push the notes. They either happen naturally, or not at all. There's nothing wrong with altering a note. As long as it blends in with the music, it is fine with me. My goal is not to have a large vocal range, but to use the one I have to the best of my ability and not mess up my voice in the process.

Well, that is my personal take on the subject

Just wanted to add that low warm tones in vocals can sound just as good as the high notes.

sofaraway2019LEVEL 48

Reply by sofaraway2019

Y'all way ahead of me. The only high notes I sing are when I stand on my tiptoes to read the screen. Sorry. I'll leave all the technique to those with a voice to get there. I understand what everyone is saying as I trained under Louis Davis (Chip Davis's dad) but as a mediocre baritone I tend to stretch to a blend note as close as I can, if I have to,I'll shift the notes to fit my voice. I only do this to offset stroke damage I have. So I tend to choose songs that fit inside that monotone range. But I'll listen to y'all sing and do backups when I can. Eat celery before you sing as it will clean any mucus from your vocal chords. No starches or dairy days before performances either, so no cookies, cakes or ice cream.God Bless.

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

Just wanted to add that low warm tones in vocals can sound just as good as the high notes.Jubi

"The Carpenters' manager said, 'As I and Karen left a restaurant in California, John Lennon was walking in and said to Karen, 'I just wanted to say that I love your voice. Love?' Karen asked me later, 'Did he really mean that?' I answered, 'Of course he did, he's John Lennon!'"

Paul McCartney has said she was "the best female voice in the world: melodic, tuneful and distinctive", while Herb Alpert said she was "the type of singer who would sit in your lap and sing in your ear"

Karen Carpenter (The Carpenters) was discovered by producer Herb Alpert (the singer of "This Guy's in Love with You"). Under the advisement of Alpert during the recording of the first album of The Carpenters Karen was told to sing an octave lower than she usually sings and thus marking a turning point in her vocal style to become the famous contralto that she is widely known for. This regardless of the fact that she had a 3 octave vocal range and yet taking Alpert's advise she became legendary in producing beautiful melodic androgynous low notes with rich warm vocal timbre arguably unparalleled in the history of modern pop music.

Moral of the story. Although it is often said the money notes are the high belting notes some manage to go against the tide by going the opposite direction and make their money notes the low notes. If anything is to learn from this story is that you play to your strengths whatever those strengths are no matter how unconventional they may be.

JPickLEVEL 72

Reply by JPickGOLD

It's funny, because the OP didn't get back to his thread

Thanks, SoloSongstress, for contributing to the thread with one of your recordings. I've never tried singing while lying, I'm sure it'd be one of my worst recordings
Most of my recordings are standing barefoot.

I agree, people can sing songs that are not really fitting their vocal range, but if that's what they like singing, nothing can stop them!

Regarding health issues, I understand the worry and I do think it's important to warn people about what they might have to face because of the way they sing.
At the same time, I can't help thinking that - no matter how much vocal training/coaching you get - professional singers are still facing those issues. Many had vocal chords damage, or nodules, or throat problems. So my personal view is that too much of anything ends up being a bad thing.
It's called "occupational disease". Like the carpal tunnel syndrome among cashiers.

Anyway, according to jeannetteb's link, my vocal range goes from bass G2 to soprano C6.
My "prima voce" goes from E3 to F5, which makes me a contralto. Thanks for the link, Jeannette!

JPickLEVEL 72

Reply by JPickGOLD

The only high notes I sing are when I stand on my tiptoes to read the screen.sofaraway2019
Best line in the whole thread!

sabathielLEVEL 44

Reply by sabathiel

It's funny, because the OP didn't get back to his thread

At the same time, I can't help thinking that - no matter how much vocal training/coaching you get - professional singers are still facing those issues. Many had vocal chords damage, or nodules, or throat problems. So my personal view is that too much of anything ends up being a bad thing.
It's called "occupational disease". Like the carpal tunnel syndrome among cashiers.

JPick

Just because you are a professional singer doesn't mean you employ proper healthy vocal technique. Many famous singers have poor and unhealthy ways of singing. Plus on top of that touring 200 days a year and singing many nights in a row for 90 - 120 minutes add to the high vocal costs that will take its toll in the long run. And then many famous singers do not take care of their voice by smoking excessively, drinking alcohol too much, taking drugs and not paying attention to their diet which may be costly to their voice. Basically, to maintain your vocal health you not only have to employ healthy and good technique but also have to take care of your instrument. You also have to do healthy vocal exercises on a daily basis.

One of the most tragic vocal demise in music is what happened to Whitney Houston's voice which happened by not taking care of her voice and to a large part through drug abuse and perhaps also cigarettes. Frank Sinatra also experienced a vocal deterioration as he grew older by smoking over 100 cigarettes a day (and being a heavy drinker) but his easy listening laid back genre means he got away with it since no high belting notes are required in his songs but he developed a much rougher voice relative to his younger days.

JPickLEVEL 72

Reply by JPickGOLD

Yeah, bad habits contribute to deterioration. Like Adele, who needed surgery at age 23.

ZZ-EdLEVEL 67

Edited reply by ZZ-EdGOLD

Every notice how so many "rock" singers have a speaking voice that is that of a disabled frog? Yet...when they sing....they sound great?

In fact, I've heard it theorized that Bing Crosby's voice had that "special sound" because of a nodule on his vocal chords. (totally unrelated random thought)

It's all very much a crap shoot.

But those who abuse their voice AND those who abuse their hearing...all pay a price.

As for those who "copy and paste" their musical wisdom HERE I have only this to say...

I have Google too...and I'm not afraid to use it.

socomicefoxLEVEL 77

Reply by socomicefoxGOLD

For every vocal question a Google search or a Youtube search will give you answerssabathiel
Thanks for the link and the explanation, but the OP wrote "I am hearing lots of singers belt out high notes/strain struggle to hit these high notes" and he was referring to SS amateurial singers. I'd like to listen to those examples. And it's just understandable most people on SS lack technique JPick

Unless those singers gave me permission to post their song up or unless they post it up themselves I am not allowed to critique or criticize anyones song in any way. All I can tell ya Jpick is no matter the level amateur or professional if a singer sings notes above their vocal range overtime they will ruin their voice permanently.

pls8xx

Reply by pls8xxGOLD

Thanks for the link and the explanation, but the OP wrote "I am hearing lots of singers belt out high notes/strain struggle to hit these high notes" and he was referring to SS amateurial singers. I'd like to listen to those examples. And it's just understandable most people on SS lack technique JPick

Unless those singers gave me permission to post their song up or unless they post it up themselves .....socomicefox

I don't make a habit of it, but I admit I sometimes can't resist doing a song out of my range.

Back At One

James

socomicefoxLEVEL 77

Edited reply by socomicefoxGOLD

It's funny, because the OP didn't get back to his thread

Thanks, SoloSongstress, for contributing to the thread with one of your recordings. I've never tried singing while lying, I'm sure it'd be one of my worst recordings
Most of my recordings are standing barefoot.

I agree, people can sing songs that are not really fitting their vocal range, but if that's what they like singing, nothing can stop them!

Regarding health issues, I understand the worry and I do think it's important to warn people about what they might have to face because of the way they sing.
At the same time, I can't help thinking that - no matter how much vocal training/coaching you get - professional singers are still facing those issues. Many had vocal chords damage, or nodules, or throat problems. So my personal view is that too much of anything ends up being a bad thing.
It's called "occupational disease". Like the carpal tunnel syndrome among cashiers.

Anyway, according to jeannetteb's link, my vocal range goes from bass G2 to soprano C6.
My "prima voce" goes from E3 to F5, which makes me a contralto. Thanks for the link, Jeannette!JPick

The meaning of this post was that singers who sing songs that go above their vocal range can ruin their voice permanently sometimes at the point of needing surgery to remove vocal nodules or needing to go on vocal rest for a year straight doing no singing or hardly any loud talking at all.

Of course there is many things that can ruin your voice. From spicy foods to not enough water in your body or drinking alot of caffeine can also put damage on your voice. These things though only temporarily messes with a persons voice. Smoking really affects the voice. And yes you are correct even if singers had vocal training if they go and sing higher than they should constantly yes overtime they will ruin their voice. Because when a singer sings higher than they should people think it helps their voice get stronger it does nothing for a voice but makes it weaker overtime it permanently damages the voice. This is something that good singers and bad singers make the mistake of doing. We get too into a song and then end up singing higher than we should just to put on a good performance the thing is when we do that we just took a step towards ruining our voice. If you are singing a high note and your voice is cracking or you are straining/struggling you are ruining your voice and singing the incorrect way no matter if it sounds good right now or not.

If a singer takes the correct approach and sings song correctly meaning if they sing their range and do not go over that then they will get their range stronger overtime. It takes practice and again you dont develop the ability to hit any high note overnight. If hitting a high note is not easy as talking and you have to force a high note and struggle to hit that high note that is called incorrect singing. If a singer is singing a high note with ease just breathing normal and using their singing muscles to hit those high notes they are singing correctly. Again singing max range is good and if you dont go over your max range you will see that overtime your range/hitting higher than your max range becomes easy.

Also I said before dont sing songs that are not your range. It is important to note you can sing any song. Just stay your range and dont go over it. For example purple rain a song I struggle with myself I know my range on this song.

I did many contests on Singsnap that required me to sing higher than my range goes. How I would do it is I would go and do a run through of the song how I am gonna sing the song required the host gave me. I would find a way to stay my range and not go over my range though I will say at times I did and well I felt it after trust me lol.

socomicefoxLEVEL 77

Reply by socomicefoxGOLD

Thanks for the link and the explanation, but the OP wrote "I am hearing lots of singers belt out high notes/strain struggle to hit these high notes" and he was referring to SS amateurial singers. I'd like to listen to those examples. And it's just understandable most people on SS lack technique JPick

Unless those singers gave me permission to post their song up or unless they post it up themselves .....socomicefox

I don't make a habit of it, but I admit I sometimes can't resist doing a song out of my range.

Back At One

Jamespls8xx

To be honest with you yea this song is a little high for your voice I did not notice much strain but I did notice your timing on this song was not great. When you hear a pause in a song or feel like one is coming up take a breath if you need to. And notice how much better your timing will improve if you actually have rhythm.

socomicefoxLEVEL 77

Edited reply by socomicefoxGOLD

@Jpick I am not allowed to give examples but I am sure in most our recordings we all have went over our range. I know I have lol.. When i sing I feel what I sing usually I sing a song I am in a mood to sing which helps me perform better but sometimes I will go over my range One thing though is noticing that and correcting it as you sing a song. For example my recent recording of shallow. http://www.singsnap.com/karaoke/watchandlisten/play/c4be069bb Some notes can feel like they are simple the most simple notes ever but we all have different voices and well lets just say my voice for this song I had to make my own range my own way. If I was to sing it at the normal range I would strain/struggle.

Annie_MusicLEVEL 103

Reply by Annie_MusicGOLD

Find your range
http://www.musicnotes.com/now/tips/determine-vocal-range/

and work with that

I googled (yes I know you can google too ) "Can a singer sing beyond their range?" and here's what came up:

"Too many singers try to sing out of their range and it makes them sing off pitch and hurt their voices. Each of us has an individual instrument ā€” learn it, accept it, strengthen it, improve it and it will serve you well. Try to sing outside of your natural range and you're tampering with nature"

In other words, work with what you have.

socomicefoxLEVEL 77

Reply by socomicefoxGOLD

Find your range
http://www.musicnotes.com/now/tips/determine-vocal-range/

and work with that

I googled (yes I know you can google too ) "Can a singer sing beyond their range?" and here's what came up:

"Too many singers try to sing out of their range and it makes them sing off pitch and hurt their voices. Each of us has an individual instrument ā€” learn it, accept it, strengthen it, improve it and it will serve you well. Try to sing outside of your natural range and you're tampering with nature"

In other words, work with what you have.

Annie_Music

Yep pretty much this! You sing your normal range you build your range.

socomicefoxLEVEL 77

Edited reply by socomicefoxGOLD

Your G1-D5 vocal range is closest to...
Mikael Akerfeldt
Your voice can span 43 piano keys! Pretty cool - that's a 3.58 octave range.

The voice of Mikael Akerfeldt spans 43 piano keys, which is a 3.58 octave range and closest to your high and lows.

https://playback.fm/vocal-range

Test your vocal range where you actually have to max your range so drink a glass of water after.

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

In other words, work with what you have.

Annie_Music

You sing your normal range you build your range.socomicefox

What you have can be expanded to the point you pretty much can sing almost anything. I use to have a deep baritone voice mainly singing Frank Sinatra easy listening songs or Joe Cocker raspy songs with a vocal range of almost 3 octaves. I then trained my voice on a daily basis for 15 minutes a day before doing my covers to upload to Youtube. Gradually my range expanded and I can create different textures and mix my head voice with my chest voice creating a solid middle register that expands all the way to a 4 octave range. I did four 30 minute sessions with a Hollywood based vocal coach named Roger Burnley through Skype who taught me how to do the vocal exercises correctly and in the most productive manner (the Skype sessions were video recorded so I can go back and watch them again whenever I want as a reference). If you do the exercises wrongly it would be pointless and you will just reinforce your old ways and bad habits. After a couple of weeks I can experience noticeable progress and after 3 months my range began to expand. I keep doing the exercises because the progress is pretty much never ending to the point from a baritone I can sing tenor or counter tenor songs. I now do Led Zeppelin songs pretty comfortably when before I had a deep baritone voice. Before I sang one challenging song and after 4 takes I suffer from vocal fatigue and my voice is hoarse needing an hour rest. Now I do 10 takes of a very very challenging song that I couldn't even sing in my 20s (I am 51) and I can still sing more takes. So basically singing with correct healthy technique means you can sing and sing (tough songs) without suffering vocal fatigue because correct technique means you utilise the correct muscles with efficient muscle coordination with very low cost of vocal "dollars".

Frank Sinatra recorded 4 years ago. Notice how the sound I produce is dark and muffled and at the back of my mouth and throaty which is incorrect technique.

Led Zeppelin after 15 months doing the vocal exercises on a daily basis.

Notice how the sound is produced at the front of the mouth or the face or what is known as "the mask" producing a ping or brighter sound which is the correct technique and helps with reaching high notes. To reach high notes in a mixed voice (a blend of chest and head voice) you need to brighten your sound....a dark sound is a dead end and cannot expand much to the high notes.....ping is king or brightness will assist you getting the high notes by not climbing to the high notes which makes it harder on yourself but rather pulling down the high notes or going down the high notes (if that makes sense).....if you have done the exercises for quite sometime you can experience the sensation of pulling down the high notes or going down the high notes rather than climbing up the high notes which is a big struggle. Also as you go up higher and higher you should really thin out your voice because the thicker the tone the more difficult to reach the higher notes....particularly for a baritone.....thinning out going up makes it easier.

If you think they are two different styles of music and hence they require two different sounds the old genre a darker sound and Led Zeppelin obviously require a pingy whiny sound. Well, not really because here is me doing a laid back old type of song and my tone is still much brighter than the Sinatra song above recorded 4 years ago. And the sound in this Ray Charles is not dark and muffled but bright and produced at the front of the face (the mask) and when I go up to the high notes I blend chest and head voice thinning the sound rather than insisting on carrying all the way up the weight of the thicker tone originating from the lower notes. I also occasionally throw in vocal fry at the onset (beginning of a phrase) or at the offset (the end of the last word of a phrase) for stylistic and artistic effect. Basically my voice becomes much freer and much more flexible with the ability to create different voice textures which assist in the creation of dynamics within the song for emotional impact. This Ray Charles song was recorded last week.

Tinypumpkin

Reply by TinypumpkinGOLD

SingSnap Is My Home and I love you all!

Thanks for the link and the explanation, but the OP wrote "I am hearing lots of singers belt out high notes/strain struggle to hit these high notes" and he was referring to SS amateurial singers. I'd like to listen to those examples. And it's just understandable most people on SS lack technique JPick

Unless those singers gave me permission to post their song up or unless they post it up themselves I am not allowed to critique or criticize anyones song in any way. All I can tell ya Jpick is no matter the level amateur or professional if a singer sings notes above their vocal range overtime they will ruin their voice permanently.socomicefox

Go ahead and post mine Soco...I have very thick skin.

ZZ-EdLEVEL 67

Reply by ZZ-EdGOLD

Just kill me.

TOMILLERLEVEL 56

Reply by TOMILLERGOLD

My comfortable range is between a D2 and G4. If I try to go above a G4 I feel like I am straining. I can sing most songs I like within this range and there are some I just have to let go...too high. It's not worth damaging what I have, and now that I am getting older recovery might not be complete if I do. Sing relaxed and do not force air through your vocal cords. Learn head resonance and falsetto techniques and develop good breath support.
No ZZ-Ed, we like having you around!!!

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

This is the "Golden Secret" to singing. Frontal placement or also known as singing in the mask or vocal twang or pharyngeal resonance or nasal resonance (not to be confused with singing nasally which is singing through the nose). This guy pretty much explained what I have said and elaborated in my previous post on this page. In summary.....PING IS KING.......find that bright vocal sound produced at the mask (front of your face/mouth). Bright sound means hitting high notes much easier than a dark sound. Find that PING in your voice. Doing the exercises daily and correctly is like going to the gym every day and lifting weights and training to build your muscles.......in the long run you will be big and strong just like me..... not biologically but rather vocally.

This is a much better exercise that you can do daily to develop that PING or brightness in your voice. Having a pingy/bright voice means your vocal placement is correct and healthy produced at THE MASK (front of the face). This is the NAY NAY NAY exercise demonstrated by the person who gave me the vocal exercises that I have been doing daily for over a year now. I actually got around 10 exercises but I only do 6 of them daily. The NAY NAY NAY is an exaggerated PINGY bright sound that conditions your voice to achieve that bright sound and forces your sound to move forward to the front or mask of your face. Of course you won't be singing this PINGY when singing a song but this develops your correct technique and frontal placement in the long run by way of conditioning. Once this habit is mastered and becomes second nature how bright you want your voice to be when singing a song can be adjusted and turned up or down depending on your artistic/stylistic choices appropriate for the song. General rule of thumb is the brighter the sound the easier to hit the high notes. This is the foundation of developing a mixed voice blending head voice with chest voice through frontal placement which can stretch to over 4 octaves where you can decide to have a 50% chest voice and 50% head voice gradually adapting the percentage lower or higher as you go up or down of the octaves. Generally more head voice mixed with less chest voice does a better job for the very high notes. So with very high notes you may want 70% head voice mixed with 30% of chest voice creating a heady mix rather than a 50 - 50 balanced mixed of chest and head voice. Do the exercises religiously and you will have more freedom, agility and flexibility in your voice. Really exaggerate the PINGY bright NAY NAY NAY and making funny ugly faces can help create that exaggerated PINGY sound.

This is Roger Burnley demonstrating the exercise go to 1 minute 11 seconds where the NAY NAY NAY exercises is demonstrated. Remember and I cannot say this enough....PING IS KING!!!

TOMILLERLEVEL 56

Reply by TOMILLERGOLD

Watch as this voice coach reacts and describes this mans singing. Hope I have the link right.
He is from Kazakstan and considered right now to have the best voice in the world. As she will describe he is very focused and relaxed. Not straining at all.

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

Watch as this voice coach reacts and describes this mans singing. Hope I have the link right.
He is from Kazakstan and considered right now to have the best voice in the world. As she will describe he is very focused and relaxed. Not straining at all.

TOMILLER

Dimash Kudaibergen is classically trained from the age of 5 and combines classical techniques with contemporary pop techniques. He has a vocal range of around 6 octaves including his whistle register/tone. At this level where you have been doing intensive training and doing vocal exercises religiously every day as a child to this very day it is not surprising you can have a 6 octave range and highly versatile vocal skills playing around with voice textures and vocal colours as you have a lot of options to choose for stylistic effect and emotional impact. However you have to remember......."if you don't use it, you lose it" meaning if you stop doing the exercises you will experience a decline in vocal prowess just like any athlete who stops training will go downhill in skill and stamina.

TOMILLERLEVEL 56

Reply by TOMILLERGOLD

Watch as this voice coach reacts and describes this mans singing. Hope I have the link right.
He is from Kazakstan and considered right now to have the best voice in the world. As she will describe he is very focused and relaxed. Not straining at all.

TOMILLER

Dimash Kudaibergen is classically trained from the age of 5 and combines classical techniques with contemporary pop techniques. He has a vocal range of around 6 octaves including his whistle register/tone. At this level where you have been doing intensive training and doing vocal exercises religiously every day as a child to this very day it is not surprising you can have a 6 octave range and highly versatile vocal skills playing around with voice textures and vocal colours as you have a lot of options to choose for stylistic effect and emotional impact. However you have to remember......."if you don't use it, you lose it" meaning if you stop doing the exercises you will experience a decline in vocal prowess just like any athlete who stops training will go downhill in skill and stamina.sabathiel

Absolutely right, my friend!!!

TOMILLERLEVEL 56

Reply by TOMILLERGOLD

I just wanted to show how relaxed he is while producing these incredible sounds.

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

The NAY NAY NAY exercise is one of the exercises Michael Jackson did under his vocal coach Seth Riggs who invented the exercise because Michael Jackson's true speaking voice is a baritone but he speaks like a child to preserve his Jackson 5 brand refusing to grow up as he sees himself as a modern day real life Peter Pan. The NAY NAY NAY exercise among other exercises helps him speaking in a bright youthful voice and employs this sound in his singing reaching very high female soprano notes with very much ease.

Seth Riggs also coaches Michael Bolton and it is no surprise both Michaels have very high vocal ranges. The NAY NAY NAYs help a lot.

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

Moral of the story is talent is overrated......passion, discipline, dedication and hard work are what separate the women from the girls......the boys from the men........the mediocre from the great. People think all these great singers just sing because of talent from birth.......they all worked damn hard to get where they got to in the end! They are "vocal jihadis"!

And singing is only half of what makes them great......they don't just sing. They bleed their hearts, project their souls, express true honest emotions, channel the cosmos, ooze the Holy Spirit, become agents of the Divine Creative Source, pour every fiber of their being, allow themselves to be vulnerable in front of strangers and whatever other appropriate metaphors you want to use. The singer entertains.......the artist takes it up a few notches by challenging people's thinking, make emotions through sound and opening people's eyes to cosmic objective reality.

Nobody......I repeat and I cannot stress enough......absolutely nobody was born with this level and standard of singing without a high dedication of hard work and passionate commitment to their art or craft!

TOMILLERLEVEL 56

Reply by TOMILLERGOLD

I've never heard or read in said better, my friend!!!!!

TOMILLERLEVEL 56

Reply by TOMILLERGOLD

Like your Tshirt, Sabathiel!!! "Gotta see the candy first"

sabathielLEVEL 44

Reply by sabathiel

You know the saying Tomi:

NO CANDY, NO HONEY!

Tinypumpkin

Reply by TinypumpkinGOLD

SingSnap Is My Home and I love you all!

Watch as this voice coach reacts and describes this mans singing. Hope I have the link right.
He is from Kazakstan and considered right now to have the best voice in the world. As she will describe he is very focused and relaxed. Not straining at all.

TOMILLER

His voice is big and strong and on top of that he is an AWESOME singer! I was listening to him all afternoon yesterday.

You have a most gorgeous voice as well Tom. Iā€™m not musically inclined but I was mesmerized by your beautiful performance.

~tiny

sabathielLEVEL 44

Reply by sabathiel

"You are not born with certain skills. You actually have to acquire them"

pls8xx

Reply by pls8xxGOLD

Having an extensive pitch range is nice. It increases the variety of songs one may sing. But vocal range by itself does not ensure a singer will be entertaining.

socomicefoxLEVEL 77

Edited reply by socomicefoxGOLD

"You are not born with certain skills. You actually have to acquire them"sabathiel

Actually you are very wrong here. Some people like myself are born with skills of being a natural singer. I was born with a good vibrato. I was born a good singer. I was born loving music and singing. I barely had any vocal coaching done for me.

Listen man... All these vocal coaches they spew bullshit. Thats right there you go they take your money they waste your time. They preach to ppl how to be a good singer.

Do you all want the truth? How to hit high range notes. How to sing good. Its called pick up the damn mic and sing if you feel yourself getting uncomfortable you are singing the wrong way stop and sing until you are comfortable. Save your damn money and time on listening to vocal coaches. Every human has different kind of voices they only that can teach you to truly sing is yourself. The only thing a vocal coach will do is help you do the things that you honestly can do on your own!!!!

When you sing. Sing as if you are talking. Sing comfortable. You should be feeling good not as if you are in a struggle or forcing yourself to sing a certain way. Sing comfortable and we you do have high notes watch your body how your muscles in your neck and in your ribs watch how they move as you sing normal. Watch how you breathe and how much breath you are taking in and how much your own body needs for low and high notes for me not much breath needed for high notes but alot more needed for low notes sometimes. Look at those things every person is different but one final thing again to not is SINGING SHOULD BE COMFORTABLE AND NEVER FORCED

Now if someone is truly having trouble in what I speak above then fine get yourself a vocal coach and they just might be able to help you understand.. But I am telling you they will just have you do sounds daily that can do on your own that every singer most likely does. It does not take much to go la la la la from the lowest note to the highest range your voice can go! Watch how your muscles again in your neck and ribs react when you go lower and higher in range when you sing. There ya go. You want to know my best vocal coach? Its called Singsnap.com singing daily having fun and staying healthy. Im done with this post good luck to yall. I made this post on ppl singing high notes the wrong way and ruining their voice. I did not make this post with the intention on telling ppl how to sing because the only one that can truly teach yourself to sing is yourself and your own confidence.

And yes Sabathiel many of your great singers are born natrual singers with the gift to sing. They didnt aquire it/those skills. Of course they practiced their voice in the years and got more stronger but they was born with the gift to sing.

One thing is certain. Anyone can sing. It might not sound good to some and some it might but welcome to the wonderful world of music! Some genres sound good some dont everyone has what they like and dislike! When I watched American Idol. I would disagree with some judges that would call some of these singers not so good. I have a good ear for music I am not tone deaf and I thought these singers sounded nice that got rejected. But again some ppl like certain unique voices/genres. Its the world of music.

StephenD2408LEVEL 68

Reply by StephenD2408GOLD

What does it matter about bad technique if it sounds good?
This guy (now dec.) has sung Somewhere over the Rainbow since in his 20's and here much older still manages to sing the best version of this song I've ever heard. On the big notes he looks not unlike the bad technique female singers example earlier in this thread. Sure looks forced to me, but sounds great to my ears.
Many of us on SingSnap have no vocal training and perhaps unfortunately take a lead from examples of our favourite performers such as this guy, but is it really all that bad?

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

"You are not born with certain skills. You actually have to acquire them"sabathiel

Actually you are very wrong here. Some people like myself are born with skills of being a natural singer. I was born with a good vibrato. I was born a good singer. socomicefox

C'mon! Were you singing at the age of 3 months or 6 months? You were crying all day and all night like a baby! LOL If you were born with singing skills you come out of your mom's belly and you would be singing like a canary with VIBRATOH - OH - OH - OH -OH....

Not all vocal coaches are created equal. Just look at Whitney Houston, Lara Fabian or Dimash........they worked damn hard to get to world class level singing. Whitney grew up singing in a black church with singing all around her meaning she would have observed and picked up the talent around her as a kid as well as being trained by her mom, Cissy.

You can acquire skills indirectly by listening or watching others and pick up things by absorbing the skills sub-consciously then mimicking them through repetition which is a type of practice. This is how you acquire the skills. It has been proven as a matter of science. You absorb what is around you rather than being born with it. The best of the best in the business have a vocal coach or have had significant vocal training in their career to get to world class standard. If not then they are what we call "BUSH SINGERS!" which can be pretty good too but not in the same class as Whitney, Lara or Dimash.

Seriously SOCO do you really think an opera singer doesn't have INTENSIVE vocal training? Talent is 20% of the game and the rest is hard work. Just like Albert Einstein said "genius is 1% talent and 99% hard work". Do you really wanna argue with a well proven genius like Einstein???

http://www.goodreads.com/quotes/115696-genius-is-1-talent-and-99-percent-hard-work

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

Pull the other one SOCO.......do you really think Jesus is an idiot?

jeannetteb

Reply by jeannettebGOLD

What does it matter about bad technique if it sounds good?
This guy (now dec.) has sung Somewhere over the Rainbow since in his 20's and here much older still manages to sing the best version of this song I've ever heard. On the big notes he looks not unlike the bad technique female singers example earlier in this thread. Sure looks forced to me, but sounds great to my ears.
Many of us on SingSnap have no vocal training and perhaps unfortunately take a lead from examples of our favourite performers such as this guy, but is it really all that bad?
StephenD2408

Forced? No way! This Guy is in control 100%! Wow! This is beautiful! Tks for sharing!

sabathielLEVEL 44

Edited reply by sabathiel

Forced? No way! This Guy is in control 100%! Wow! This is beautiful! Tks for sharing!jeannetteb

I agree. He is in full control and employs good technique. The placement is good....frontal in the mask. The sound is bright not muffled at the back of the mouth meaning he employs twang or mask singing. You can tell the high notes he can go even higher and are executed with relative ease. He is Billy Thorpe a famous commercial rock singer........meaning singing "Over the Rainbow" is a BREEEEEEEEEZE in the park as his rock songs would be far far more challenging. It's kinda like Rod Stewart switching from rock to jazz with his American songbook repertoire. Not really a good example to use to show bad technique.

You see the problem is that people have different ears and not all ears are created equal either. So to an untrained ear what sounds as forced may not sound as so to a trained ear and vice versa. Not only not all ears are created equal the knowledge possessed by the person with the ears vary from person to person meaning the more knowledge you have the more likely you are to pick up the nuances in sounds produced by various singers. I mean how many here can even tell where the sounds are produced in the mouth of the singers in the videos posted on this thread? You know like at the front or at the back of the mouth? A year ago I have no clue what that means and I thought to myself how can you tell? Now that I can produce those sounds using different vocal placement by default, through experience, I can relate to what is happening in a singer's mouth or larynx when they are producing sounds while singing.......I go "argh.......that's what he is doing....that's a good efficient way of producing the sound and if he is a commercial touring singer singing day in day out.....he will not be hoarse even after singing 2 hours of rock songs"

If you ask why employ good technique? Well, try singing songs like"Born to Run" (in the original key) 7 takes in a row and see if you can keep on going for another hour. If you get tired and need a break then your technique is bad. Now imagine you are pro rock singer and tour around the world 6 months singing night after night at 2 hour gigs? This is where good technique will help massively and take you a long way by not killing yourself night after night meaning you will experience longevity singing exactly the same way you did in your 20s all the way to your 70s. If all you wanna do is sing as a hobby 4 - 5 songs a week at karaoke.....yes! you can get away with bad technique but your options when singing remain limited compared to a singer having sound vocal production through a healthy technique. Hobbyists can get away with it, pros especially depending on your genre...has to consider employing good technique for obvious reasons already stated. The more passion you have, the more you care!

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